Ralph Ellis writes:
As an aside, I am going to be talking about these subjects at the Beyond
Knowledge conference in Liverpool in September. All welcome.
http://66.147.242.98/~urbanmy1/beyond-knowledge/
.
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Saturday, August 15, 2009
Keyword News: [atheism]
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| Friday, August 14, 2009 10:21 PM PDT |
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Friday, August 14, 2009
[JesusMysteries] Philo on Jesus?
How do scholars address the fact that Philo makes no mention of any Jesus in his period at all, even though he had a relative married into the family of Herod at the time?
David S
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Thursday, August 13, 2009
Christ Conspiracy God needs a Creationism exhibit in Tulsa!
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[TC-Alternate-list] Omissions in the UBS text shown to be Haplography errors
We have formatted Nazaroo's posts on CF which illustrate that about 1/3 of the omissions in the Gospels chosen by the UBS editors are in fact just haplography gaffs.
While this proves that Aleph and B had a common ancestor, it also shows conclusively that their combined testimony is far too often not the original text at all.
http://adultera.awardspace.com/SUPLEM/UBSgaffs.html
mr.scrivener
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While this proves that Aleph and B had a common ancestor, it also shows conclusively that their combined testimony is far too often not the original text at all.
http://adultera.awardspace.com/SUPLEM/UBSgaffs.html
mr.scrivener
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Wednesday, August 12, 2009
PaleoBabble
PaleoBabble |
Posted: 11 Aug 2009 07:49 PM PDT Believe it or not, sometimes the media gets something about ancient texts right. My friend Mark Goodacre (New Testament professor at Duke) posted this note (with video) about a good (!) BBC treatment of the number 666/616 in the book of Revelation. Thanks to Mark for this one! |
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Freethought Examiner: Iranian women imprisoned for converting to Christianity
| Like that of non-believers during the times when the Christian Church reigned supreme, the persecution of non-Muslims in the Islamic world has been well known for centuries, but it appears to be reaching a peak with the emboldened Islamists ... Read more » Freethought Examiner, D.M. Murdock  D.M. Murdock, also known as Acharya S, is an independent scholar of comparative religion and mythology from a "freethinking" perspective. She is the author of The Christ Conspiracy, Suns of God, Who was Jesus? and Christ in Egypt. Her work was featured in the movie Zeitgeist and Bill Maher's Religulous. Her main website is TruthBeKnown.com. | |
Tuesday, August 11, 2009
[TC-Alternate-list] Vaticanus 1968 Replica NT and Numbers in Its Lower Right Margins
Over at the textualcriticism group a link was posted which provided a huge download of the 1968 color facsimile of the NT portion of Codex Vaticanus:
megafileupload.com/en/file/124461/Vaticanus-1968-pdf.html
The file is huge, but the space is well-used; these images are very nice. I have no idea how the 1968 pictures of Vaticanus can be legally distributed online, though.
Anyway, after sorting through the images, I noticed some unusual numerals that occur in the lower right-hand corners of pages 1245, 1265, 1305, 1325, 1345, 1365, 1383 (/not/ 1385), 1405, and 1425. (And the numerals keep on going, every 20 pages.)
It looks like someone wanted to place a numeral in the lower right hand corner of the page, on every 20th page. The numeral is repeated: first it is expressed in Greek letters, and then it is expressed in Roman numerals, except the Roman numerals are more like tallies than what we think of nowadays as proper Roman numerals; instead of using "L" to represent "50" there are 5 X's.
On p. 1245, 64 is expressed by Xi-Delta and by XXXXXXIIII, with the "IIII" written as a wavy scribble. (The page ends at Mt. 9:28.)
On p. 1265, 65 is expressed by Xi-Epsilon and by XXXXXX with what looks like the English letter "b" but which must be intended to represent "5." (Page ends at Mt. 22:36.)
On p. 1285, 66 is expressed by Xi-Stau and by XXXXXX with what looks like "//" (but which should be understood, it would seem, as blurred symbols for 5 and 1). (Page ends at Mk. 6:26)
On p. 1305, 67 is expressed by Xi-Zeta and by XXXXXX with what looks like "///" (but which should be understood, it would seem, as the symbols for 5, 1, and 1, totaling 7). (Page ends at Luke 1:55.)
On p. 1325, 68 is expressed by Xi-Eta and by XXXXXX with a scribble which must be VIII. (Page ends at Luke 11:11.)
On p. 1345, 69 is expressed by Xi-Theta and by XXXXXX with a scribble which looks like I and IIIII with the last four I's overdotted (which was supposed to mean "repeat this," I figure). (Page ends at Luke 23:5)
On p. 1365, 70 is expressed by Omicron and by XXXXXXX. (Page ends at John 10:27.)
On p. 1383, 71 is expressed by Omicron-Alpha and by XXXXXXXI. (The alpha looks like a cursive "X" at first because the arc on the left is faint, and the character has a tail.) (Page ends at Acts 2:14)
On p. 1405, 72 is expressed by Omicron-Beta and by XXXXXXXII. (Page ends at Acts 16:12.)
On p. 1425, 73 is expressed by Omicron-Gamma and by XXXXXXXIII. (Page ends at the end of Acts.)
I wonder if it was ever typical to write Roman numerals in this way, without using "L" for 50, and using "I" so much. It looks unusual to me. If it was indeed unusual, and other MSS have this sort of numeral-representat ion, this could be a clue about where the codex might have been at the time when numerals were written in this way.
(1245, divided by 20, is 62.25. So it would seem that on every 20th page, from the very beginning of the codex, these numbers were written down, but some counting-mistakes occurred. Or maybe the mistake was in the Arabic numerals.)
(I asked the same question at textualcriticism, but no one has replied yet; I may try again since I posted in the middle of a flurry-filled discussion about something not nearly as interesting as this is.)
Yours in Christ,
James Snapp, Jr.
P.S. In the color images of Vaticanus, you can clearly see umlauts in the first /cursive/ page in Hebrews.
------------------------------------
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megafileupload.com/en/file/124461/Vaticanus-1968-pdf.html
The file is huge, but the space is well-used; these images are very nice. I have no idea how the 1968 pictures of Vaticanus can be legally distributed online, though.
Anyway, after sorting through the images, I noticed some unusual numerals that occur in the lower right-hand corners of pages 1245, 1265, 1305, 1325, 1345, 1365, 1383 (/not/ 1385), 1405, and 1425. (And the numerals keep on going, every 20 pages.)
It looks like someone wanted to place a numeral in the lower right hand corner of the page, on every 20th page. The numeral is repeated: first it is expressed in Greek letters, and then it is expressed in Roman numerals, except the Roman numerals are more like tallies than what we think of nowadays as proper Roman numerals; instead of using "L" to represent "50" there are 5 X's.
On p. 1245, 64 is expressed by Xi-Delta and by XXXXXXIIII, with the "IIII" written as a wavy scribble. (The page ends at Mt. 9:28.)
On p. 1265, 65 is expressed by Xi-Epsilon and by XXXXXX with what looks like the English letter "b" but which must be intended to represent "5." (Page ends at Mt. 22:36.)
On p. 1285, 66 is expressed by Xi-Stau and by XXXXXX with what looks like "//" (but which should be understood, it would seem, as blurred symbols for 5 and 1). (Page ends at Mk. 6:26)
On p. 1305, 67 is expressed by Xi-Zeta and by XXXXXX with what looks like "///" (but which should be understood, it would seem, as the symbols for 5, 1, and 1, totaling 7). (Page ends at Luke 1:55.)
On p. 1325, 68 is expressed by Xi-Eta and by XXXXXX with a scribble which must be VIII. (Page ends at Luke 11:11.)
On p. 1345, 69 is expressed by Xi-Theta and by XXXXXX with a scribble which looks like I and IIIII with the last four I's overdotted (which was supposed to mean "repeat this," I figure). (Page ends at Luke 23:5)
On p. 1365, 70 is expressed by Omicron and by XXXXXXX. (Page ends at John 10:27.)
On p. 1383, 71 is expressed by Omicron-Alpha and by XXXXXXXI. (The alpha looks like a cursive "X" at first because the arc on the left is faint, and the character has a tail.) (Page ends at Acts 2:14)
On p. 1405, 72 is expressed by Omicron-Beta and by XXXXXXXII. (Page ends at Acts 16:12.)
On p. 1425, 73 is expressed by Omicron-Gamma and by XXXXXXXIII. (Page ends at the end of Acts.)
I wonder if it was ever typical to write Roman numerals in this way, without using "L" for 50, and using "I" so much. It looks unusual to me. If it was indeed unusual, and other MSS have this sort of numeral-representat ion, this could be a clue about where the codex might have been at the time when numerals were written in this way.
(1245, divided by 20, is 62.25. So it would seem that on every 20th page, from the very beginning of the codex, these numbers were written down, but some counting-mistakes occurred. Or maybe the mistake was in the Arabic numerals.)
(I asked the same question at textualcriticism, but no one has replied yet; I may try again since I posted in the middle of a flurry-filled discussion about something not nearly as interesting as this is.)
Yours in Christ,
James Snapp, Jr.
P.S. In the color images of Vaticanus, you can clearly see umlauts in the first /cursive/ page in Hebrews.
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[TC-Alternate-list] Sensational Theories and Stephan Huller
Ben,
It looks like R.J. has been reading "The Real Messiah," by Stephan Huller, an author whose work, unfortunately, seems to be of a genre somewhere between The Bible Code and The Da Vinci Code. As far as I can tell, Huller's Big Idea is that Agrippa was the real Messiah. And, as far as I can tell, he seems to think that Jesus saw Messiahship as a sort of dynastic position and wanted Mark to be the next Messiah-office-holder. Robert Price sums up Huller's ideas at
http://frommessiahtopariah.blogspot.com/2007/04/robert-price.html
(Over at the textualcriticism group, Huller seems to be experimenting with a defense of the idea that the Gospel of John is very late -- late enough to reflect the author's awareness of the Marcionites. To do that, he has to say that P52 is something other that what it is; i.e., instead of being a part of the Gospel of Mark, that it is part of a some sort of Super-Gospel text resembling the Diatessaron in its scope.)
Yours in Christ,
James Snapp, Jr.
------------------------------------
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It looks like R.J. has been reading "The Real Messiah," by Stephan Huller, an author whose work, unfortunately, seems to be of a genre somewhere between The Bible Code and The Da Vinci Code. As far as I can tell, Huller's Big Idea is that Agrippa was the real Messiah. And, as far as I can tell, he seems to think that Jesus saw Messiahship as a sort of dynastic position and wanted Mark to be the next Messiah-office-holder. Robert Price sums up Huller's ideas at
http://frommessiahtopariah.blogspot.com/2007/04/robert-price.html
(Over at the textualcriticism group, Huller seems to be experimenting with a defense of the idea that the Gospel of John is very late -- late enough to reflect the author's awareness of the Marcionites. To do that, he has to say that P52 is something other that what it is; i.e., instead of being a part of the Gospel of Mark, that it is part of a some sort of Super-Gospel text resembling the Diatessaron in its scope.)
Yours in Christ,
James Snapp, Jr.
------------------------------------
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To visit your group on the web, go to:
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Keyword News: [atheism]
| Tuesday, August 11, 2009 2:21 AM PDT |
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Monday, August 10, 2009
[TC-Alternate-list] Matthew 13:36-43 - any MSS omit?
| Is anyone aware of any variants in Matthew 13:36-43? Are there any MSS perhaps that omit it? It seems unlikely to be original considering that the seed is not interpreted as the word as in the parable of the sower, and that it is too overtly predestinarian to be original, perhaps even too overtly predestinarian to pre-date Augustine. It is more natural to understand the parable of the sower as related to corruption of the scriptures as Dionysius of Corinth did (see Eusebius Ecclesiastical History Book 4 chapter 23). Seems likely that the "the Lord's exposition of the parable" which Augustine cites against Faustus when Faustus interprets the parable like Dionysius as premising corruption in Scripture, was forged between the time of Dionysius and Augustine. I know it is the case whether any MSS have been found that omit it or not, but it would be nice to have a MSS that omits it to point to. |
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[JesusMysteries] Talmud Shabbat 116A
The story contained in page 116a-b of Tractate Shabbat is very interesting. The philosopher min (heretic) is not identified as a Christian in his meeting with Rabban Gamaliel in approximately 100 CE, and the philosopher-judge tells Rabban Gamaliel that since the destruction of the Temple the Torah law has been abrogated. As some sort of Christian, one would imagine a direct reference to Jesus/Yeshu as the reason for the abrogation (according to Paulist Christianity) or at least the coming and death of the Messiah (according to gospels).Yet this is not mentioned. All that is mentioned is a less that direct reference by Rabban Gamaliel in his debate with the philosopher to Matthew 5:17, which obviously already existed in 100 CE. I supposed this is a veiled argument against Paulist doctrine. Yet the person doing the abolishing is never mentioned by the philosopher.Just an interesting piece of documentation. We see no reference to Jesus himself or to Paul or
to anyone else who the philosopher heretic may have been following.
David S
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to anyone else who the philosopher heretic may have been following.
David S
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Christ Conspiracy YouTube - Rejecting Islam ( Produced by 3 Apostate Ladies of Islam )
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CFI Indiana Schedule--August 10-16, 2009
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Sunday, August 09, 2009
Freethought Examiner: West's conflict with Islam coming to a head?
| Muslim woman in Great Britain Recent incidents in France, Germany, the U.S. and Great Britain serve to highlight an ongoing problem with the rampantly open-ended immigration of the past few decades into these countries, especially from Islamic ... Read more » Freethought Examiner, D.M. Murdock D.M. Murdock, also known as Acharya S, is an independent scholar of comparative religion and mythology from a "freethinking" perspective. She is the author of The Christ Conspiracy, Suns of God, Who was Jesus? and Christ in Egypt. Her work was featured in the movie Zeitgeist and Bill Maher's Religulous. Her main website is TruthBeKnown.com. | ||
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